Who will you fight for(simplified)

[Skywalker312]

plain and simple, good or evil?

[Elegost of the Dunèdain]

Evil!

Isengard to be precise.

[zAk]

id ont like that way of dividing because Harad for instance for most of its history was neutral or the Mirkwood Elves werent as good as they are usually shown here...

[Erkenbrand]

Evil!

Of course :twisted:

[rimmsy]

id ont like that way of dividing because Harad for instance for most of its history was neutral or the Mirkwood Elves werent as good as they are usually shown here...

Harad were evil, Elves were good. Very simple.

[Lyte]

Since I am one of the leaders of the campaign, I can't fight. But if I did, it will be for good, hands down(even though I did win those battles with an evil force, sky.) The Elves are too cool for me not to play them... 8)

[Dorthonion]

Not fighting - plotting!

[Suladan, the Serpent Lord]

Evil for me! Harad forever. :)

[SB129]

In case anyone couldn't tell, EVIL! :twisted: (Isengard)

[Londrandir of Mirkwood]

I will be playing good in the Palantir campaign

[zAk]

id ont like that way of dividing because Harad for instance for most of its history was neutral or the Mirkwood Elves werent as good as they are usually shown here...

Harad were evil, Elves were good. Very simple.

no not really... have you read the history of Harad or the Hobbit. I didnt say my point to decide what to vote for but to show my opinion on how dumb the system is in the Good/Bad division although something has changed - the new rulebook is well made when it comes to that...

[Skywalker312]

Evil for me! Harad forever. :)

Thats the spirit, HARAD FOREVER!!!

[tHeGOblinkiNg]

EVIL!! Moria rules! :twisted:

[korvachan]

I'm playin good, yay for the Dwarves~

[LAE671]

Good- Long live the steward!

[Losliath]

id ont like that way of dividing because Harad for instance for most of its history was neutral or the Mirkwood Elves werent as good as they are usually shown here...

Harad were evil, Elves were good. Very simple.

no not really... have you read the history of Harad or the Hobbit. I didnt say my point to decide what to vote for but to show my opinion on how dumb the system is in the Good/Bad division although something has changed - the new rulebook is well made when it comes to that...

Um actually yeah I have read those and much of Tolkien's other works outside of the Trilogy. Harad were men that faught against Gondor and many of which were black Numenorians that were seduced into the cult of Sauron and followed him. Other men of Harad were at Sauron's beck and call and often led by the decendants of the Black Numenorians which ruled Umbar and became the Corsairs of Umbar which harassed the seas for Gondor and any other good nation. THe history of Harad is Mat Ward fluff which is fine for gaming but isn't real history. I think that's enough to classify Harad as solidly EVIL.

Oh yeah I'll be leading Lothlorien, so good.

[Lyte]

Los explained the Harad is evil part, so I'll explain the Mirkwood is good part(In a small way.)


If you read the hobbit, it says that the Elves have the MOST hatred for the orcs, so orcs are evil, and elves hate orcs...Elves are good. Also, there was no "Dark/Evil Elves" in Tolkiens books, anything related to that would be the first orcs, which were tortured and mutilated elves.

[Skywalker312]

Los explained the Harad is evil part, so I'll explain the Mirkwood is good part(In a small way.)


If you read the hobbit, it says that the Elves have the MOST hatred for the orcs, so orcs are evil, and elves hate orcs...Elves are good. Also, there was no "Dark/Evil Elves" in Tolkiens books, anything related to that would be the first orcs, which were tortured and mutilated elves.

yeah, there were dark elves, but as Ecthelion said, that didn't make them evil, they just didn't see the light of the two trees. Long story short, Elves=good, Harad=evil, and evil's going to win the whole thing!

[zAk]

Los explained the Harad is evil part, so I'll explain the Mirkwood is good part(In a small way.)


If you read the hobbit, it says that the Elves have the MOST hatred for the orcs, so orcs are evil, and elves hate orcs...Elves are good. Also, there was no "Dark/Evil Elves" in Tolkiens books, anything related to that would be the first orcs, which were tortured and mutilated elves.

Am i saying Harad was angels of goodness and elves evil of Sauron????Im just saying there is something called neutrality, something that most people are...


also your comment doesnt change the fact that elves had a VERY negative look on the hobbits and dwarves. My point is that in Middle Earth just like in the real world not everything is perfectly good and otherwise evil. For instance was Gondor bad just because they had a craaazy steward? Or were the Dwarves perfectly good if they were ready to fight the elves? of course the elves were not very good to dwarves too... Im sure there are many mmany more other examples.

[Losliath]

No I think it really is that simple, the elves and dwarves disliking each other goes back to Turgon and the Simarills. Harad was not neutral at all, they fought for Sauron that makes them evil. Sauron being THE MOST EVIL being in middle earth at the time, making them evil by association. Elves, Dwarves and Men though they may have their petty squabbles still fight against Sauron and his minions making them good. One of the major points in Tolkiens writing is there is a purposeful and very clear line between GOOD and EVIL, there are very few shades of grey. Just because a group does not act ie the Hobbits that does not make the neutral, and for all of Tolkien's purposes the elves of Mirkwood were good and the men of HArad evil.

[Skywalker312]

Not that i agree with either of you (personally, i lean towards zAk's point of view, but that doesn't matter)could you get back on topic, and quit arguing about whats good or evil. to clarify, are you fighting for good or evil, by the standards of LotR SBG.

thanks,

Sky

[rimmsy]

Am i saying Harad was angels of goodness and elves evil of Sauron????Im just saying there is something called neutrality, something that most people are...

You're saying something but I think it's pretty definate that for the purposes of the campaign, each allegiance will be either good or evil. You won't find bands of good goblins running around trying to help the elves, or any good Haradrim fighting on Gondor's side.

[American Viking]

That's my question as well. I intend to fight for Good, more specifically as Gondor or Gondor Fiefdoms, but I still want to know, how does the campaign work?

[zAk]

No I think it really is that simple, the elves and dwarves disliking each other goes back to Turgon and the Simarills. Harad was not neutral at all, they fought for Sauron that makes them evil. Sauron being THE MOST EVIL being in middle earth at the time, making them evil by association. Elves, Dwarves and Men though they may have their petty squabbles still fight against Sauron and his minions making them good. One of the major points in Tolkiens writing is there is a purposeful and very clear line between GOOD and EVIL, there are very few shades of grey. Just because a group does not act ie the Hobbits that does not make the neutral, and for all of Tolkien's purposes the elves of Mirkwood were good and the men of HArad evil.

Im not going to keep on arguing but i can say Boromir was lured by the power of the ring and acting evil, it could easily be the same with Harad and the Haradrim being men that are very very soft to promises. As to the Wood Elves i stay on my opinion because i remember the elves wanted to kill the dwarves it wasnt just dislike...

Back on subject ill be playing Evil that is Harad. American Viking - acctually no one really knows how long, and how will the campaign be.
All we know is that it will be 6 months or something like that long, that the whole thing will be played out between alegiances and VotR will be alowed! Personally im looking forward to the campaign and cant wait to see what it looks like! YAy!


zAk :lol:

[American Viking]

Yeah, but how the heck do we resolve the battles. If we do them between players as normal games, then I can't do much, because their isn't anybody on the forum who lives in Poznań, as far as I know

[zAk]

Yeah, but how the heck do we resolve the battles. If we do them between players as normal games, then I can't do much, because their isn't anybody on the forum who lives in Poznań, as far as I know

Wait wait??? Youre in POznan??? i thought you are in the US, anyways i think the campaign will not be resolved between the players but our victories. As an example i play with an Dol Amroth player here in Wroclaw and i post up the result of the battle (victory is mine of course!). At least to me thats how it is... there are many ways of playing a campaign. I think thats how it is its the only reasonable way to do it, like the GW campaign...

zAk

[American Viking]

I got it, thanks. PGA is going on at the international fair grounds in Poznań

[Skywalker312]

yay, we got majority, can't wait to see how you ninnies are going to fare if it goes like that! EVIL RULES :twisted:

[The_sea_of_Rhun]

Wow its good 39% and evil 60%
There are dark forces at work :!: :!: :!:
cheers

[Suladan, the Serpent Lord]

Told ya our Elephants will crush the silver-men! :)

[LAE671]

Quality not quantity Sky :P I'm in for Good of course, Gondor and the Tin Men all the way!

Cheers,
LAE671

[Ortheron]

Wow its good 39% and evil 60%
There are dark forces at work :!: :!: :!:
cheers
make that 38% good, 61% evil..... :twisted:

[American Viking]

We're gonna shoot up Your elephants before they can do anything to us!!

[Skywalker312]

heh, better watch out behind you, else the wargs will bite you in the butt when you arent looking :lol:

[tHeGOblinkiNg]

Wow its good 39% and evil 60%
There are dark forces at work :!: :!: :!:
cheers
make that 38% good, 61% evil..... :twisted:
Ugghh. now it's only 59% evil, 40% good. C'mon evil!!! :twisted:

[zAk]

Wow its good 39% and evil 60%
There are dark forces at work :!: :!: :!:
cheers
make that 38% good, 61% evil..... :twisted:
Ugghh. now it's only 59% evil, 40% good. C'mon evil!!! :twisted:

not any more now its 60% evil :D

[The_sea_of_Rhun]

Wow its good 39% and evil 60%
There are dark forces at work :!: :!: :!:
cheers
make that 38% good, 61% evil..... :twisted:
Ugghh. now it's only 59% evil, 40% good. C'mon evil!!! :twisted:

not any more now its 60% evil :D

Where art thou 1%
It's crazyiness :P

cheers

[Edit by Ecthelion -- Too many smilies]

[tHeGOblinkiNg]

ooooh. 62% now :shock:

:P

[ungoliant]

evil ftw
moria
harad
mordor

[Faramir_of_Ithilien]

If there is ever a campaign, evil..